Manuel Mitchell

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Personal narrative of Manuel Mitchell
From: Manuel Mitchell (mm)
Medium: Audio tape
Date: Thursday, April 29, 1999
Place: Home of Manuel Mitchell, 6596 N. 100 E. Marion, Indiana 46952
Collected by: Sarah Simpson (ss)

00:00 ss: This is April 29th, 1999. This is being recorded at 6596 North 100 East. I am speaking with Manuel Mitchell. Please state your name.

mm: Manuel Mitchell

ss: Do I have permission to interview you?

mm: Yes you do.

ss: Do I have permission to submit this interview to Marion High School?

mm: Yes you do.

ss: Do I have permission to submit this interview to the Marion Public Library?

mm: Yes you do.

ss: Thank you.

00:28 ss: Um, what was Marion life and Grant County life, um, like during the 1940s?

mm: Well, it was quite a bit different what it is now. Uh, there’s no streetcars now and uh, uh, lot of old buildings has been torn down and a few little ones, uh, built. Uh, the old Spencer Hotel is here no more. Uh, uh, my memory ain’t too good on a lot of things. Uh, back during that time, uh, uh, but there have been quite a bit of changes, but uh, you forget about. Uh, (inaudible) changes has probably, uh, maybe not for the good. (Laugh)

ss: (laugh)

mm: Uh, I think, uh, there been a lot of changes and, uh, uh, the way the schools discipline, well, kids.

ss: Right.

mm: Uh, when I went to school, uh, if you got caught doing something wrong, they used a paddle on you right then. And they didn’t kick you out for two or three days. You know, like they do now. And, uh, when you was punished, you knew what you was punished for. And you know what to expect if it happened again. That’s that’s some of the changes. Uh, in the schools. Uh, I don’t think the teachers has, uh, the choice of doing that now. I think the government, uh, has a lot to say about what they can do and what they can’t do (inaudible). Course the the schools classes are a lot bigger now than what they used to be. Um, but uh, other than that, uh, I don’t know if there was too much, uh, uh, difference in what the, uh, the schools was when I went to school. Uh, we didn’t have the cafeterias like you do now, uh, most the kids carried their lunch in a paper bag or newspapers. Some had their buckets and service bottles. Um, that’s probably some, uh, some of the other changes that’s different. Uh, and I, uh, remember too, uh, earlier a lot of the kids went to school barefooted. A lot of ‘em didn’t, really didn’t have shoes to wear. You know back, uh, back then, uh, but, uh, other than that I think the school system pretty well ‘bout ‘bout like it was then, except, except, uh, punishment part has been changed (laugh) uh, uh, and that, uh, I think that’s that’s for, that’s the bad part. I think, I think that kids should know when they’re doing something wrong that they’re gonna have to pay for it. And now too many of them gets by and I don’t blame the teachers, I blame the government ‘cause the government, government tells them what they can do and what they can’t do and that’s the bad part.

04:37 ss: Where did you attend, sorry.

mm: Uh, I’m sorry?

ss: Where did you attend school?

mm: Where did I go to school? Well, the first seven years I went, uh, an old country school in, uh, Howard County, Union Township. That was only, uh, when I was in seventh grade and that was called junior high. And uh, there was only seven of us in a class and uh, and then uh, some of the earlier grades they had two classes together like uh, the fifth and sixth, the third and fourth, the first and second. Uh, then when we come to move to Sims, went to school at Swayzee. And there was a few more, well, quite a few more kids in my class then. Uh, uh, just off hand, I would say maybe twenty to twenty five maybe and uh, and even then this was in uh, when I went, ‘cause I didn’t graduate, I went to uh, my junior year, but uh, I got a whipping when I was in high school. And I was, I was just sitting next to, next to a window and looking out the window and uh, J.P. Sumpter, uh, he was the coach and uh, and uh, math teacher. And while he was talking I was looking out the window ‘cause I was sitting right beside it. He said, “Mitchell, what are you doing?” And I said, “Nothing.” He says, “You go down to Mr. Downing’s room and bring his paddle up here.” Well, I headed down and got it and uh, there was a glass partition between the math class and the typing class. All the typing class could, could see me get a whippin’. And all the math, all the math class could see it. And when he laid the wood to me, there wasn’t nobody cracked a smile or nothing. Everybody kept, kept a straight face and was more less looking at their work ahead, in front of them. ‘Cause I was leaning over the desk watching them. (laugh). I don’t know how many times he hit me with that paddle but I know, I know that I had a whipping. That was the last whipping I got in school. And then I, I had one when in Union, when I was just in the fourth grade. And, uh, what happened that time was, uh, the W.P.A. had, had done a lot of work along the road and uh, the school had a shop class back from the school about, uh, gosh I don’t know, uh, a hundred yards maybe and there’s a lot of loose chunks of sod and stuff lying around and we’s at recess and, uh, us kids was throwing these chunks of clod at each other. Well, as I got ready to throw one, this kid running in front of the door of the shop and just as I’d throwed it, the teacher stepped out and caught him right in the face. And, he got ahold of me and paddled me all the way up to the school building. And, and uh, his wife happened to be my teacher and uh, she didn’t know what was wrong with me ‘cause when I went into school to sit down at the desk, I was crying. And, uh, she said, “What’s the matter with you Manuel?” And uh, I never said nothing. But uh, them was the two whippings that I got in school. Uh, and I seen other kids get whippings. They didn’t, they didn’t send you home. They didn’t do that. They, they, they worked you over right there. Uh, and I think it’s better, I think it, I think it uh, the kids might not like it then but I think, you know, later on they, they uh, uh, at least I did. I thought I, uh, I had more respect for ‘em and uh, not all kids needs a whippin’. Kids are all different. Some of ‘em needs, may need a whippin’ and others may just need to be talked to. And uh, anyhow, that’s, that’s, that’s the main difference I think in the way schools run now. Other than they had a lot of, you know now they have a little computers. Kids has computers and, and uh, course they never even heard of computers. Uh, uh, that’s, that’s uh, that’s a main difference I think. I do remember, uh, when I went to school at Swayzee uh, there’s a boy on the school bus that he he’d been causing, you know, trying to pick fights on the bus and uh, (inaudible) Marshall was a bus driver and uh, he stopped the bus. This was out in the country on the way between Swayzee and Sims and uh, this boy was from Alabama and he was, he was, for his age, should’ve been in four or five grades higher than what he was and he was bigger than most kids, you know, uh, so when the bus driver went back to uh, uh, talk to him or do whatever he was gonna do, he pulled a knife on the bus driver. And uh, (inaudible) Marshall kicked him off the bus right out there in the country. Boy, if they would do that now, they’d have the bus driver in jail. (Laugh) But uh, uh that’s, that’s what I can remember, uh, mostly about the schools.

ss: Did, did you participate in any activities while you were in school?

mm: Uh, I’m sorry?

ss: Did you participate in any activities, extracurricular activities like bands or clubs?

mm: No, uh, there was uh, course there was kids that took band. I never. Uh, course they had basketball and baseball. Uh, and that’s the main sports that they had. But I didn’t, I didn’t play, I didn’t play baseball or basketball or either one. Uh, when I went to school at Swayzee, uh, uh, all the kids were tooken over to Dr. Reesner’s office to be examined to see if they was able to play. And as I remember right, me and Arthur Donovich, uh wasn’t able to play. I don’t know, it was, uh, uh something ‘bout, it might’ve been our blood pressure or heartbeat or something, but, uh, so I didn’t, I didn’t play. My brother played but I, but I never. And then when I went to be examined for the army, uh, I didn’t, I wasn’t, they didn’t take me for the army for, for same same reasons, and, uh, uh, I don’t know if I had a irregular heartbeat then, I do now, so that might’ve been, that might’ve been part of it and course now I have high blood pressure. I don’t know if I did then or not they never, they never, the doctors never told you nothin’ they just examined you and told you whether you could play or whether you couldn’t. But uh, but they did have bands but I never, I never you know, played in a band or nothin’. Uh. Is there anything else?

13:35 ss: Um, how did you meet your wife?

mm: Well, uh, uh, uh, I met her and uh, we lived at Sims and uh, this church right next door to our house, and uh, I wasn’t going with anybody in particular. But uh, uh, different, uh Sundays, I’d, I’d see these two girls and I’d never, I’d never seen ‘em before and I, I thought they looked pretty nice (laugh) and uh, so I thought, well I’ll just go to church and uh, you know, get a closer look at them (laugh) and uh, so uh, I didn’t know who they were and uh, as I found out later that their preacher was picking them up in Swayzee and bringing them to Sims to church. So one day I, I went over and to church and I sat down beside of her and never talked to her or nothin’ just sit down side of her and that’s that’s that’s how I met her was in church. Uh, uh, was there anything else then?

ss: Oh, did you, did you guys date for awhile before you got married?

mm: Uh, not very long! (Laugh) Uh, her cousin, her cousin uh, got married in uh, Simpson County, Kentucky. Didn’t have to have, uh, didn’t have to have no blood test or nothin’ like you do now and so I just had a job on a railroad and I worked on a section and I just drawed my, my first check and it wasn’t uh, it wasn’t uh, full pay, and uh, so uh, I seen her and her cousin, uh, one Saturday night and she said she’s gonna stay on night with her cousin, and uh, so I said, “Well, I’ll, I’ll just take you, uh, take you to your cousin’s,” and I had dad’s car. I planned on going to Marion and uh, so, in the meantime, I, I had two other girls in the car and uh, so they wanted to stop and go to the grocery store and when they, and my wife and, and her cousin was sitting in a car, and course they all knew each other and as they were at the grocery store they seen Louise so they went over and talked to her and told her that, that I was taking ‘em to Marion to show. (Laugh) And when they went to the store, she come over, Louise come over to the car where I was and says, “You better take them girls home,” (laugh) and uh, uh, I don’t know what all she told me, uh, somethin’ ‘bout if I ever, if she ever want me to speak to her again or something or another that order, so I didn’t have another boy with me to be with the other girl, so I just took, I took them two girls home. And then on the way taking her to her cousin’s, she wanted to go to Kentucky and get married. And I said, “Well, I don’t have the money.” I said, “All, all I gots uh, what I drawed on my first check,” and it wasn’t a full pay and uh, but anyhow she convinced me that uh, that it was the thing to do so uh, uh I dropped her off at her cousin’s and I went home and got a clean pair of dress pants and shirt and everything, and uh, and, and went back to her cousin’s and uh, we’s gonna go to Marion to catch a bus and we got back to Swayzee and I’d seen my brother and uh, (inaudible) and uh, I had them to go with us so they could bring dad’s car back to Marion. So we caught the bus and we uh, uh, went to Simpson County, Kentucky and was uh, Franklin, Kentucky was uh, was uh, where we got married just, just a few miles from the Tennessee line. And went there on Sunday and uh, stayed in an ol’ uh, they called it a hotel and uh, the next day, Monday at 10:00, we went to the courthouse and uh, J.W. James married us. He was some relation to the uh, uh Jesse James and uh, so after we were married then we caught the bus and came back home and when I got back home, seventeen dollars was all I had and didn’t have no place to live or didn’t have no car and uh, all I had was a job. So we stayed with her folks and till we found a room in Swayzee and eventually she give us two rooms and then later we moved into a three room apartment. And then, finally to Marion. Uh, so that’s how, that’s how I got married.

ss: What…

mm: And that’s been uh, be fifty two years this May.

ss: Oh, ok.

mm: And that’s quite awhile.

19:30 ss: Um, did you have any children soon after you were married?

mm: What’s that?

ss: Did you have children soon after you were married?

mm: We had uh, after we was married uh, a little over a year, we had our first boy, Manuel Eugene. And then uh, about a year and a half after that, we had a second boy, Randy. And then about ten or twelve years later, we had another boy, Steve. And didn’t have no girls. Uh, uh, that was our family. Uh, uh, when we first got married, uh, uh, when we lived in the house where we had uh, the three rooms we had uh, a stove and course I worked on a railroad at that time and uh, bring home old railroad ties to saw up and we’d saw them up to burn them. You know, in the wintertime for heat. Uh, then one Christmas her dad had a half a ton of coal sent down for us to burn. So that’s a quite a bit different than what it is now. (Laugh) Uh, um…

ss: What was it like raising your children?

mm: Well, uh, uh I don’t know uh, after we were married uh, awhile, she finally got a job too. Uh, she worked at, uh, shoe factory a little while and uh, which is not here no more and uh, then after that, uh I think in ’55 she got a job at General Tire and she worked out there thirty, thirty some years and retired uh, I think in ’89 or ’90. She had a muscle disease and, and uh, she doctors over at the Bluffton Clinic, so she had to retire. And then I retired a short time after that at uh, after I quit working on the railroad I got a job as a, as a construction worker and uh, that’s what I did until I retired.

ss: Were those the only two jobs you pretty much held?

mm: What’s that?

ss: Were those your major jobs, working with the railroad and construction?

mm: Yeah, uh, I worked on railroad part-time when I was in high school during the summer ‘cause they was uh, there were raising track and uh, it took a lot of extra help. Uh, normally the section crew just consisted of three to four people. But during the time they was raising track there was several of us kids from high school work during the summer helping them do that and I was working on the railroad when I got married. But uh, shortly after that, uh I started working construction work, uh, here in Marion and course I worked, I worked out of the Union Hall and I worked uh, uh, worked at Kokomo as much as I did Marion or more. Uh, worked on the Salamonie River bridge when they put I-69 through. I worked on that bridge, I worked on different school, school buildings, uh, Chester Center in Wells County called Southern Wells when they built that, I, I was working there. Uh, uh, (inaudible) then I worked at shopping centers, shopping malls, uh, on different stores and uh, worked, worked in housing uh, that’s, that’s the main. Construction was my main, main job. Course this house, I, I built this house while I was doing, doing that, you know, and my part-time, you know, weekends and evenings. Uh, uh, that was ’71 when we moved in here after I got finished which took me, took me about two years working weekends and evenings to get it done. And, and that’s about all I know about that type of workin’ I done and earlier before, even before worked on the railroad I worked in several, several factories but workin’ inside, it’s never, it’s never suited me. I worked at the shoe factory just a few days, I worked at Spencer Cardinal a few days, I worked at the cheese factory a few days and I, the only factory that I really liked, well, I worked at Osborne Paper, uh, Company too a few days. But, I got a job at Continental Steel at Kokomo and that was really the only factory job that I liked. Uh, it was uh, uh, where I worked they built fence and it was uh, uh, I had keep spools of wire to this machine and uh, it was a real noisy, noisy place to work. But I kinda, I kinda enjoyed it, but uh, it still wasn’t like being outside and that’s why I choose uh, construction cause most the time it was outdoors.

26:26 ss: You said, you said you had three boys right?

mm: Had what?

ss: Three boys.

mm: Yeah, three boys.

ss: Do you have any memorable stories about them growing up, raising your boys?

mm: Well, uh, yeah, one (laugh) uh, I’ve always been a gun enthusiast and uh, my boys wasn’t able enough, wasn’t old enough to drive. But during this time, and their life and mine, uh, everybody was doing a lot of varmit hunting and stuff and I had bought a new rifle and uh, so we was driving out through the country and I was looking for hawks to shoot at so I decided to let my oldest boy drive and I’d sit in the back seat and uh, with the window down, where I could you know if I see, you seen these turkey vultures how they circle around and crows and uh, so I thought, “Well, I’ll get in the back seat,” and uh, cause a driving, I wouldn’t be able to shoot at nothing, but driving. So I let, uh, Eugene, the oldest boy, drive and the other boy was in the front seat with him and I was in the back seat and neither, neither one of them had, was old enough to drive. And uh, afterward, being out driving around through the country awhile, why, on the way back home, uh we come through Windfall. And uh, I didn’t want him drive right down through the middle of town in case, you know, something would happen and get caught, so as we come into town, uh, uh, I told him to when we come up to the street I said uh, “I want you to turn and we’ll dodge part of the main part of town,” and I didn’t, didn’t tell him soon enough and when he started turning we knocked down a, knocked down a stop sign (laugh) and, and uh, I don’t know why nobody ever seen us but it, it was, there was houses on both sides of the street and we ran completely over that sign and so then I had him get in the back and I drove on home. Uh, it didn’t do any damage to the car much but uh, it did tear a stop sign down. And uh, uh, I don’t think he drove anymore till he got his license. Uh, so that’s about. And then one other time, uh, you know how kids would let their hair grow real long. Well, well, that never, that never went over too good with me and the oldest boy, he got to letting his hair you know, grow long. And so I sent him to the barber shop. You know, he come back and I couldn’t tell he’d had a haircut so I sent Randy with him and sent him again. And when he come home again looking this same way, I don’t think they went to the barber shop. So I, I gave him a real hard whipping and uh, and then I cut his hair. But the boys never, never caused me you know, any problems or nothing. They were, all of them, good boys. But uh, I, I did uh, I did uh, punish him probably too hard when, when I whipped him but, but uh, uh, I never had any problems since. I have more problems with her. (Laugh)

ss: (Laugh)

mm: Uh, uh we went uh, lets see Friday that uh, must be Wednesday night, Wednesday night, we went out there to the funeral of the lady that we knew that passed away and uh, there’s people there that we hadn’t seen for long time and she asked, asked that lady’s brother, says uh, “Do you know who I am?” And he said, “No.” She says, “I’m that guy’s boss that’s down there,” pointing at me. Uh, uh, just for a joke. Yeah, I think I had three pretty, pretty nice boys.

31:50 ss: Did you participate, did you participate in any community activities?

mm: Uh, what’s that now?

ss: Did you participate in any community activities?

mm: No, not really, no. No.

32:10 ss: Um, what were your feelings about the war going on in 1940s? The World War II.

mm: Uh, well, uh, you talking just about World War II? Uh, well, we were kinda uh, forced to get into that really. Uh, course you know the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor. And uh, course there had been a lot of stories about that too about Roosevelt knowing ahead of time that they were gonna be attacked and didn’t do nothing about it. And uh, my feeling is that this was during the Depression time and there wasn’t much work and what work there was didn’t pay nothing and I think, uh, I think that was one of the reasons that we got involved in it was uh, uh, it uh, well I’m thinking it would get people jobs, you know, building uh military stuff, but I think, I think it was a bad deal. I think if he knew ahead of time that there was gonna be an attack they should have got them ships out of Pearl Harbor. Which he didn’t do. And now that’s, that’s, that’s a story I always heard, that he knew for a long time that, that we was gonna be attacked in December. He didn’t know what day but it was gonna be in December. Uh, uh, and then of course, after we was attacked there was no choice, you know.

34:13 ss: What, what was it liv-, what was it like living around here while the war was going on?

mm: Around here?

ss: What was it like?

mm: Well, I wasn’t quite old enough to go to the service during the war, uh, I turned eighteen ‘bout time the war ended. But the troop trains, when I lived at Sims, uh, they had, uh all the trains that come through Sims, uh, most of them stopped and took our water ‘cause there’s a water tank there. And uh, when the troop trains come through, uh to stop to get water, uh, soldiers on the train would, uh, let us kids run over to the store and get them candy bars, cigarettes, different things. And we could always tell when a troop train was coming because it had a different whistle and uh, they pulled, I don’t know, maybe thirteen, fourteen coachers there and maybe a few more and uh, uh, they usually come through in the evening, just about dark and uh, most of them that come through Sims was going West but uh, the trains that pulled the military hardware, like trucks, tanks, and uh, artillery stuff, their trains was mostly going East. Uh, but that’s, that’s, that’s one thing I remember ‘bout uh, during the war. Us kids would always wait on them troop trains because we know they’s gonna give us money you know, and what, if there’s any change left, they’d have us keep it, you know, for getting it for them. Uh, then uh, people had flags that they put in their window. Uh, if they had a, had a son in the service they had, had a flag that uh, would have one star, two stars, whatever, how ever many they had in the window. And most people, a lot of people back then, didn’t have refrigerators either. The ice man would come around and they had a square card with numbers on it. If I remember right, the cards was green and red and it had fifty, twenty five, or ten, or fifteen, you know, numbers and it’d stick that in the window and when the ice man come, he’d know how big a chunk of ice to bring in for the ice box. And my grandmother and grandparents never did have a radio or a refrigerator, a washing machine until just about a year before she died. And we never had uh, we never had a radio. We had telephone. My grandparents never even had a telephone But we did have a telephone and cooked just on a three burner oil stove. Uh, this is back there in the second world war. We had an old cow we milked for milk. Uh, my dad drove a Huckster wagon that he’d trade. You know what they are?

ss: No.

mm: Well, they are, they are little grocery stores on wheels. Uh, it’s a truck with uh, they, they had, they have few groceries. Uh, nothing, they couldn’t carry anything that had to be refrigerated. Like cold cuts or ice cream or anything like that and uh, all the cookies and stuff, they didn’t come in packages like they do now. They was just in a bulk, you could buy three, or two, or half a dozen. And most the farmers back then, they didn’t have much money either and they would uh, when uh, I would drive with dad sometimes in the summertime (inaudible) and they would bring out chickens to trade for groceries like sugar and flour, kerosene. They even carried some dried goods. The women made dresses and aprons and bonnets and stuff like that at home. Uh, but uh, they didn’t have uh, uh, and course the old general store and that’s what this was. It was in the store that they had you could buy anything almost. Nails, bolts, uh haulders for cows, and and uh, bridles for horses and uh, just all kinds of things like that. Vinegar came in a big keg and uh, you go to the store and get, pick up a bottle of vinegar uh, you crank it out, you know. And same way with uh, uh kerosene and uh, bananas come on a great big stalk that they hung from the ceiling and all the, all the cookings. They had saltfish. You know what that is?

ss: No.

mm: It’s uh, it’s a big barrel that stood about this high, about that big around and they had uh, fish in there, but they were in the salt and I’m not sure what kind they was but uh, that’s how, that’s how the fish came. Not like the ones in Marsh’s uh like buying fish. And uh, farmers did a lot of butchering that they don’t do much anymore. They make their own lard, cracklins’, uh, they would press the they’d have this big kettle and first all they would have a uh, uh, some of them would use a barrel that would have boiling hot water in it. They had a fire in it, but uh, when they’d slide that hog down into the boil and this hot water would uh, soften the skin and the hair on the hog. When you take it out, you take a knife and scrape all the hair off and uh, then you would go ahead and cut the hog up and then cut the, the skin in little chunks with a little bit of meat and fat, throw it all into a kettle and uh, get it hot and kept it stirred and when it was cooked to the right uh, temperature then they would uh dip it out and put it into this lard press and then they, they crank that press down and squeeze all that fat out into a, a little tin bucket, about the size of a five gallon bucket, and uh, after that was all pressed out then you would have the cracklins left in this little bag. And they, they were real good. They eat while they was hot. Uh, that’s something they don’t do much anymore. Uh, and uh, the women took care after the men would cut the hogs up and the women would take part of it and they’d either fix the hams or sometimes they’d cut it all up and make whole hog sausage. And uh, they’d mix them up in big dish pans and season them, you know, with salt and sage. Uh, and course they always had bacon and fresh (inaudible) and uh, uh ham, shoulder, uh all real good.

ss: I have one last question. What, this goes back to war, what was the atmosphere like when people found out that we had won the war and people were coming home?

mm: The second world war?

ss: Mm, hmm.

mm: Well, everybody was happy. It was just like uh, you know them ticker tape parades you know that you see going down through (inaudible) it was just like that. Uh, everybody was you know, glad that it was over. Uh, I had a friend of mine who spent about two years in a German prison camp. He was a tail gunner on a flying fortress. And they got shot down over Germany. Uh, I’ve heard a lot of different tales about them camps uh, some of ‘em, some people I knew in camps had, had a heart. But uh, this fellow told me, he said they didn’t have a lot to eat, but they had enough to eat. And uh, they’d get to go out and play softball, you know, maybe once or twice a week. But uh, and then others, others had it a lot rougher than that. I think it depend on the officers probably. Some of ‘em were, er, (tape switches sides) better feeling towards the P.O.W.s. But it left a lot of them mentally in bad shape. I disagree with what Clinton’s doing, uh, uh. Right now, they’re killing a lot of people you know, the people the other day said they was fifty homes destroyed and six hundred of them damaged and course they don’t know how many of them civilians gets killed and that’s where we start doing this, this guy over there started treating them worse. Uh, yeah, I think if they ain’t careful, it could get into a bigger, bigger war, bigger than what it is. Uh, I don’t have no use for Clinton myself. Uh, I don’t think a draft dodger should ever be a commander of chief of the military. I don’t believe that. Uh, he ran off to Russia and give this country a bad name for us being in Vietnam. I just don’t have no use for him period. That’s all I got to say about him. There’s two guys I’d like to see be president. And uh, one of them is Dan Quayle and the other one is Pat Buchanan. Uh, this U.N. business is a bad, bad thing and I don’t think most people really knows what is gonna be like when they get in full control. Uh, Pat Buchanan made a statement that the day he became president would be the day we would drop out of the U.N. and I think that is what we should do. (Phone rings-stop tape)

48:34 ss: Do you have any other last memories that were outstanding during the 1940s?

mm: Memories about what now?

ss: Just any outstanding memories that you have, any last?

mm: No, uh, (wife-when he met me!) not anything uh, not anything that I would call real outstanding. Uh, everybody, everybody is just about the same, day in, day out. Everybody had their chores to do and uh, things to do and you get done, and uh, uh, that’s what we did. I can’t think of anything, uh, real outstanding. Uh, (wife talking in background).

ss: Well, that’s pretty much all I have to ask.

mm: OK

ss: And I appreciate you, I appreciate it very much that you’d sit down and let me interview you.

mm: Yeah. I hope I can help you out.

ss: This will be a lot of help. Thank you!

mm: Uh-huh.